Friday, June 08, 2007

mgm - more than just a dead movie studio

mutilation of malodorous mucilaginous male membrane

On the subject of female genital mutilation or female circumcision, and its male no-comparison-according-to-some counterpart, which I briefly alluded to in my women under Islam post, here's a fascinating take from a Moslem woman. Even more interesting is the commentary, especially pertaining to male circumcision/mutilation [mgm], how much of it is cultural, how much medical. Though just about all the commentary is informative.
After this wealth of information, I feel the jury's still out on whether fgm is a cultural or religious practice. Clearly it predates Islam, but that hardly proves that it was a purely cultural practice. As if there ever was a culture entirely separate from religion or vice versa. As to whether Islam has discouraged or encouraged the practice, there are commentators who argue vehemently for each side. So who can you believe? The main thing is to denounce and eliminate the practice, and there are encouraging signs that more and more states are getting on board.
I've never been circumcised/mutilated myself, and naturally I've wondered if my life would've been different...



At 9:29 pm , Anonymous Anonymous said...

my life is different than it would have been

At 10:34 am , Blogger Stewart said...

hmmm... is this a comment on my grammar or expression? If so, I think I prefer my version, otherwise I wouldn't have written it that way. more immediate, and more open. The closed version is a bit flat and dull. On the other hand, if you're writing about your own life, good on ya.

At 3:23 am , Blogger pommygranate said...


thanks for the link.

At 5:35 am , Anonymous Anonymous said...

This is big threat to all the humanbeings, forget 'bout the female circusion everyone knows by now, what are the the phases a girl has to go through(if she is lucky(unlucky?) enogh to to live), There's ia missconception that circumcised male are less likly to get infection of HIV as the foreskin in not present. I challange there will always be some friction due to which skin tear is gonna happen, so blood contamination... so Spraiding of HIV. I think all the Muslims are spraiding HIV, coz they don't use any protection, thingking that that they are BLOODY "HALF CUT".

At 2:00 am , Anonymous whatevs said...

As opposed to "anonymous" previous statement, the person (thing) is obviously uneducated when it comes to the issue of Muslims. As to them spreading HIV you are GREATLY mistaken. And if you were joking, it was probably the worst joke i have ever heard. As for you, Muslims are the people who are the least likely to GET infected with HIV, because of their strict sexual policies. Get a life, you idiot.

At 11:51 am , Blogger Stewart said...

Strange remarks left here over time. The fact is that AIDS is largely controlled in the west, through greater education and awareness of sexual matters, not through abstinence. AIDS on the other hand is rampant through many African Moslem countries. Here's to evidence and education.

At 4:33 pm , Anonymous Melisa said...

Omg thats an awful thing!! How come you can circumcise women idiots ?? I can uderstand men but women shouldnt ever be circumcised! Also İslam forbids it, I am a muslim too but a person who thinks women should be circumcised couldnt understand Qur'an exactly.
Here is the true information from Wikipedia.

Female genital cutting is not commanded by the Qur'an[46] and is not practiced by the majority of Muslims.[35] In Egypt, mufti Sheikh Ali Gomaa stated: "The traditional form of excision is a practice totally banned by Islam because of the compelling evidence of the extensive damage it causes to women's bodies and minds." [47]

At 2:57 pm , Anonymous Anonymous said...


At 1:23 am , Anonymous Anonymous said...

i am a muslim .. i know nobody in my family or friends , whatdoes it for a girl !!! :OOO

At 5:09 am , Anonymous Anonymous said...
u have 2 read this!!!

At 10:44 am , Anonymous Anonymous said...

I had a circumcision because things were tight and it was holding me back and i was sensitive about it, however after having the operation i now have scars left from the stitching which to most people would look rather different. Although things are cleaner and perhaps are alightly bigger (or at least appear that way), i'm now held back and sensitive about my scars. I can't win. Damn NHS! Sorry i had to write or say this somewhere or other.

At 8:57 am , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Just wondering... Why should male circumcision be treated any differently that female circumcision? They both involve cutting off part of someone's genitals.

At 10:49 am , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why should male circumcision be treated any differently that female circumcision?

Are you kidding ? Because “Female circumcision” is not actually circumcision at all but complete removal of a womens sensitive sex organ. It is not cutting off a skin covering over the main sex organ like is don e to a male, rather it is complete removal of that entire sex organ itself.

Male circumcision leaves the male fully functional sexually and may have some benefits to him in not having to clean under the skin covering anymore.

Females however have had their sexual organ (the clitoris) cut off during this procedure. In case you did not know though much smaller than the male penis, this is in fact the actual female sex organ itself where all sexual pleasure originates and through which a women experiences the sensations of sex and is bought to orgasm. This is in the same way that the penis of a man is the actual male sex organ through which he experiences sex and reaches orgasm. The birth canal remains for reproduction, just as a male has testicles for reproduction. This is the equivalent though for a women of removing a males penis but leaving his testicles. While the remaining vagina can not be removed as it is mainly a hole this is all the woman has been left with. A hole. Sometimes though in certain cultures, also the vaginal opening is then sewn shut and sealed, later to be forcefully or surgically gouged open again when a man who owns her, desires to first use her vagina for his own pleasure and/or to allow for child birth and sometimes it is then sew or burned shut again.

The effect on a Male with a circumcision is that the penis has no longer got a protective cover of skin over it's it. He still has this organ however and enjoys sex and functions normally.

The effect of female so called circumcision is that the women no longer has her sex organ at all. Sometimes the the skin covering it is removed as well but always the actual organ is taken completely out as the purpose is not cosmetic as in the male procedure. Rather it is meant to ensure she can never enjoy and participate in sex. Males and Females are designed to both experience pleasure and orgasm during sex. Women may often find it inherently more pleasurable than a man as she is able to have more intense orgasms and have them multiple times during intercourse. With out her Clitoris though a women has a reproductive opening “a hole” and nothing more. She has not her normal sex drive o r function sexually. She will never experience sex. She can reproduce though if a male forcefully penetrates her and the male may still enjoy sex with her (since he still has his sex organ) but she will experience nothing at best or more likely pain like when being raped since her body is not capable of reacting to him with sexual arousal or it's natural responses.

A women who has been castrated in this way would have no desire to have sex, experience no joy or release in sex. It is done on young girls usually before 15 as they having no idea what sex is supposed to feel like and no hope of ever finding this out are less likely to commit suicide after a forced mutilation has robbed her of any sexual experience forever. She still would likely never be inclined to have sex at all. This practice is usually found in cultures where men can own women like cattle and use them at will to satisfy their desires, or they can be forced or pressured into the DUTY of having sex with their husband. A castrated women with out her sex organ has no natural desire to have sex with a man and would get virtually nothing out of it.

At 11:30 am , Blogger Stewart said...

Thanks for this last comment, which pretty well sums up the awfulness of fgm.
I'm wondering though why people are still commenting on this old post, while nobody's been commenting on my current postings for ages! I suppose this post is showing up on google or something. Oh well, I'm grateful for the commentary.

At 12:03 pm , Blogger zeroluke said...

Nope to me they are both the same. Regardless if one has "only a bit of skin" removed and has some sense left and the other has a fair bit more removed and feels much less. Should both be outlawed in the Uk and world wide. The British army should stop the practice too. Its un-necessary and more men would be willing to join. The only reason they took the practice up is because 1 queen victoria believed the english were a lost civilisation of israel/palastine jews/ christians, she made it fashionable since the royals set the trends ( including smoking), which isn't likely since there have been people in england longer than 2000 years ( pagans have existed in england longer than the 2 religions existed). The second reason the army took upon itself to carry out the procedure upon the recommendation of India's doctors of the middle east when colonisation was in full throw. It was to curb playing with themselves since the act itself was seen as socially unclean, not literally.

And low and behold, if you repeat a lie for a few thousand years it appears to become true, because no-one knows any different. Also even some unspeakable acts first become tollerated, then accepted and then condoned. Because after a few generations nobody knows any different.

At 2:34 pm , Anonymous Anonymous said...

I am a circumcised male, and in no way do I feel "mutilated". In fact I feel offended when you call this practice, which has just as many benefits as being uncut, "mutilation".

At 8:06 pm , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Viagra works on the body by increasing the flow of blood through male sex organ, thereby giving erection essential for sexual pleasure.

At 6:28 am , Anonymous Anonymous said...

What the hell is wrong with people?
The foreskin is there to PROTECT the head of the penis.
It’s a natural part of the body, why should it be just chopped off? If you wiki this topic, you’ll see that according to word-wide statistics, men with the procedure are LESS prevalent that men with it. It’s mostly practiced in Muslim countries and the US. Men in Latin America and Europe are almost 100% uncircumcised. I married a woman from Latin America, and once asked if any of her brothers/cousins, ales in the family had it done, she said it was barbaric and would had never even heard of such a thing done on a perfectly healthy male. I’m tired of watching Seinfeld (reruns), Caroline in the City(very old reruns), Friends, and other made in Hollywood crap with gives the perception that ALL men have had it done.
I can barely recall an episode where Jerry asks one of his friends if they had ever “seen one” (w/o the procedure).
I have my full intact foreskin, and most of the guys that I’ve talk to around here do so too. What the hell is so wrong with this culture when we think of the natural state of the penis as dirty and defective?
For all of you idiots wanting to do this on your child for the cleanliness issue, I have a tip for you:

Now… can we stop this NONSENSE??

At 2:19 pm , Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'd like to start off with this: Wikipedia is incorrect. Any shmoe can go on there and put whatever bs he wants to just so that people will think it's true. Wiki, is garbage. Bring me a Dr.'s note, then we'll talk.

FGM and Male circumsision are two TOTALLY different procedures.

FGM is commonly practiced on girls between the ages of 8 and 10 years old that are fully concious, aren't under any supresant or anesthetic, and are in the WORSTE Hygenic area possible. These young girls are being subjected to bacteria and viruses I don't even want to begin to think of. They aren't just losing parts of their vaginas, some of them are even having any opening at all closed up. Throughout these girls' entire lives, they will be experiencing pain with childbirth, sex, urination, even their menstral cycle will be painful due to the acidity of the blood. They will be facing these consequences their entire life.

Baby boys are born andimmediatly are taken to A STERYLE room with STERYLE utensils are are worked on very precicly with the best care and attention. They don't have any complications while growing up, and they don't remember or recall or even feel any of the pain from the procedure. The young boys are given medicines and ointments and creams and everything under the sun to keep things from festering down there. The two are NOTHING alike. It's just ignorance and stupidity fueling this whole thing.

These girls are undergoing a much more difficult and horrible process than these baby boys.

If you want to pull pictures of male circumsision from the internet to show how "gruesome" it is, I'll go get some of the ones of the things that are happening to these poor women and we'll compare scars.

I am 17 years old and, yes, I've done my research. I make more sence than any of the rest of you. Get off you're pompous pedistules, stop hating mommy and daddy for cutting up your peepee, and think for a minute. An uncircumsized penis looks, well, gross. A circumsized one looks more presentable and is easier to keep clean. (yes, I went there) There's no getting around it. And, as much as they're the same, (BS) a circumsized vagina looks painful. there's nothing clean about it. I can put every penny I own down that every man that has ever read this, that will ever read this and, that will ever think about reading this that has been circumsized will agree that they have no recollection of anything that happened to them cause their parents wanted a decent looking penis on their child, and not an earthhworm. The women that have been cut and torn apart will probably tell you it's the most painful thing they've ever gone through in their lives. Here's an idea... Why don't all of you try it and let me know how it goes. I'll be waiting on the sidelines and I can deffinately say that when I have a son, he will be circumsized.

Thanks, Have a nice day.

At 7:28 pm , Anonymous David said...

Coming from Australia Male circumsision comes and goes in its popularity i my self am circumsised, all but a couple of my piers were also as opposed to children now, very few are. After a trip to Kenya and discussing FGM with some locals we got some startling revilations about the reasons why and from what we could gather it was for the girls benifit to keep her faithfull, and as a symbol of womenhood (a culture of multiple wives could also be said to contribute to needing to control wives "urges")
I believe that calling FGM "female Circumsision" is very missleading and and in no way can be compaired to the male virsion of which i believe does have a health benifit (nothing to do with preventing AIDS though)
anyway .. i am sure all this has been touched on before.
But i liken the comparison as to getting your 10 year old son taking him down to the shed (garage) and with a communal pair of secateurs that were last used on his best friend 2 doors down, That no one has seen for 2 weeks since his "ceremony", having uncles hold him down as one proceeds to cut off the glans (head) of your 10 year olds penis. for boys that would be about the end of it. But for girls, In many cultures they are proceeded after the removal of the clitorus and any thing els that got in the way, to be stitched up, sometimes so well that they are unable to urinate, pass menstral blood, and well that is just not a pretty picture in itself, But when they get a husband, they will be unstitched only then for the reason of sex.

My culture is one i dont have alot to do with (Australian Aboriginal) as i was adopted out at birth but in talking to some people there are initiation ceremonies that involve male genital mutilation. i do not know the details or if it is still widly practiced (if at all).

At 1:11 pm , Anonymous Anonymous said...

All of you women are wrong. I was mutilated and you weren't, and believe me, you all are retarded to think that flaying babies has benefits to their health. Cleanliness my ass, literally! All that was done to me was that the protective layers that would have kept the shit in my diaper off of my sexual organs were removed. You wouldn't shove feces up a female infant's vagina, would you; because, that is basically what was done to me. Health benefits? My penis is full of scar tissue, calluses, and acid burns from peeing. It is completely numb, and if you knew anything about why circumcision was adopted in the US, you wouldn't be talking about it the way you do! It was first implemented to keep men from "abusing themselves". It has nothing to do with cleanliness. It was designed to make sex painful for men! That's why they only leave the pain and temperature recepting nerves! You all make me sick!

At 6:33 pm , Blogger Quilan said...

Leaving 'religion' out of these comments on 'male' circumcision helps. I'm circ'd (male) and I love it. It was my choice and I paid for it. I look at the whole experience in the same way that other people view their own lovely cosmetic surgery procedures. For myself, it had really nothing to do with cleanliness. I'm an adult and know very well how to wash myself. I got cut (high and tight) because it looks great (to me) and feels great! I don't have any reduced feeling at all and sex with my wife is great (still). Different people have different views but 'as long as a person has the intelligence and ability to choose for themselves (very important) then anything goes! What I don't agree with is forcing circumcision on the young as they have no idea yet as to what they like/don't like and are not mature/experienced (and shouldn't be until they've had a long and happy childhood). Female circ can be view in the same way because a cosmetic procedure done 'by informed adult choice' cannot be argued against BUT the barbaric mutilation of women (sewing/burning) so that some bloke can 'own' a women as 'property' is wrong. Damn, I hope that all comes across as I'd hoped... bw&s all :¬)

At 2:32 am , Blogger karthi said...

god has given the body..we all know the preaching and teaching is completely about love and peace for any religion..then why should we cut it off??..we are not eligible to satisfy the gods needs!!did the god ask anything to you?..never!!!since all the things in the world are created by every thing in the world have holiness and god lies in every life of a creature!!!

At 12:50 pm , Blogger Sandi said...

I am 39 years of age and was trimmed at the age of 10 (OUCH!) due to urinary infection. at the recommendation of my doctor, my parents agreed to allow the procedure to be performed. I couldn't possibly know if it would of made any difference in my sexual experiences. All I know is that it functions as it should and it is not an eye sore for me or any of my partners. I'm actually glad it was done and most importantly, my urinary infection never returned.

At 2:42 pm , Anonymous Anonymous said...

I have a PENIS!

At 11:26 am , Anonymous Anonymous said...

I am just recovering from being circumcised a couple of days ago,had to go into hospital as I couldnt urinate,turns out the really bad infection was caused by having too much forskin which was so bad I couldnt pee(due to infection),now at home with a capheter still inserted and taking ages to shower and get the dressing changed each day.Going back to hospital in 4 days to get checked out and hopefully have the capheter removed.Hopefully after all this everything will be ok,only time will tell I suppose.Suprisingly I was expecting very severe pain but theres not really been much pain so far(fingers crossed!)

At 9:04 am , Blogger Rumah Cahaya said...

I am a Muslim from Indonesia.
male circumcision is required by my religion to keep it clean, avoid venereal disease and more enjoyable for women.

whereas for women, circumcision is not required, if a woman wants to be circumcised just little deducted. should not be too much. just a little scratch to be more sensitive, of course, not eliminate.

thanks have discussed

At 9:25 am , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Circumcistion is stupid. It was created years ago and continues due to lazyiness. Just wash your penis. Its that simple.

I wish my penis had not been circumsized. I've never been happy with my penis cause of it. Thank goodness I have some resisual foreskin to work with. Ive seen some poor soles that truely were mutilated.

Lets stop cutting people unless their life is in immediate danger.

At 3:00 pm , Anonymous wannabedesi said...

Oddly enough Male Circumcision has never killed a man.
FGM has killed women before, made it difficult for them to urinate, and to give birth. At best they have discomfort for the rest of their lives. At worst they die during child birth. Please, Male Circumcision hurts, but in the long run the only thing damaged might be the mans pride.

At 5:32 pm , Anonymous WOO said...

Males have died from circumcision, most of them were newborn babies though, not men.
This site is a picture gallery of circumcision gone awry, not ok. Considering that these boys have to live with the consequences of their parents decision (or lack thereof) for their entire lives!

At 10:25 am , Anonymous Anonymous said...

who ever got hiv/aids from a Muslim this is for you, you shouldn't be sleeping around with anyone, if every one stop acting like animals and stopped sleeping with people there would be no aids and all the other things out there. But if you still what to go ahead and do what you want when you get hiv or aids dont blame others for your act or doing.


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